Author Topic: Zimmerman Found Not Guilty  (Read 106829 times)

sheclown

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Re: Zimmerman Found Not Guilty
« Reply #675 on: July 21, 2013, 09:44:41 PM »
We are all affected by institutional racism.  Until we can be brave enough to have this conversation, nothing of significance will change.

I'm not talking about one aspect here -- where or not some of Z's best buds were black or not, I'm talking about something much broader and wider.

We are all diminished by it, our world and our future is made smaller because of it. 
« Last Edit: July 21, 2013, 09:47:09 PM by sheclown »

Shine

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Re: Zimmerman Found Not Guilty
« Reply #676 on: July 22, 2013, 08:47:16 AM »
Jaybird, how has this been "proven false?"
Shine, in a place like the Southside of Chicago or even our Moncrief, your "reasonable" approach would get you mugged 9 out of 10 times. If a creepy guy you don't know is following you in the dark & rain, he's typically up to no good.
Crump was acquitted by a jury
« Last Edit: July 22, 2013, 08:49:29 AM by Shine »

FSBA

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Re: Zimmerman Found Not Guilty
« Reply #677 on: July 22, 2013, 09:17:41 AM »
I think if Zimmerman had it to do all over again, he would probably do it exactly the same way.  He got away with it after all.  And now he's famous and a folk hero amongst a bunch of people who fantasize that they too can kill a teenager that they don't like the looks of.

When the book and film money comes rolling in, and he sues broadcast news to settle for an undisclosed sum, the lesson will be complete:  "Does your life suck?  Are you a loser nobody?  Shoot a kid!  It helps if he's black, but anyone 'scary' will do!"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5hfYJsQAhl0

For the sake of arguement, let's go ahead and assume Zimmerman was out for blood that night. He is an evil racist who just wanted to kill a black man.

Do it all over again? Including where he had his name drug through the media, hounded wherever he went for over a year, and essentially made out to be the worst human being imaginable?

Then again maybe he'll reconsider when it dawns on him he will have virtually no private life and will have to watch his back 24/7. Atleast until the likes of Jesse Jackson and Al Sharpton find a fresher source of blood to suck off.


thelakelander

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Re: Zimmerman Found Not Guilty
« Reply #678 on: July 22, 2013, 09:24:49 AM »
Jaybird, how has this been "proven false?"
Shine, in a place like the Southside of Chicago or even our Moncrief, your "reasonable" approach would get you mugged 9 out of 10 times. If a creepy guy you don't know is following you in the dark & rain, he's typically up to no good.
Crump was acquitted by a jury

Most keep harping on race.  Even those that say the issue isn't about race. You even mentioned it by bringing up an example of another killing with skin colors switched to prove your point. Since I believe in the concept of Institutional Racism is alive and well in our country, the only real racial connection I see in this particular trial is the initial profiling of Martin, which set off the entire chain of events, IMO. GZ doesn't view TM as a suspicious person if he was not of a male of a certain skin color. No following happens and each guy goes on his merry way.

However, the real issue (which I think we both agree on) is the interpretation and understanding of laws surrounding this particular case.  For me, that's not about race. No one, regardless of their skin color, should be able to be legally killed under these types of circumstances.  If we need to better flesh out laws and our understanding on them, then let's do it.

BridgeTroll

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Re: Zimmerman Found Not Guilty
« Reply #679 on: July 22, 2013, 10:00:10 AM »
I think if Zimmerman had it to do all over again, he would probably do it exactly the same way.  He got away with it after all.  And now he's famous and a folk hero amongst a bunch of people who fantasize that they too can kill a teenager that they don't like the looks of.

When the book and film money comes rolling in, and he sues broadcast news to settle for an undisclosed sum, the lesson will be complete:  "Does your life suck?  Are you a loser nobody?  Shoot a kid!  It helps if he's black, but anyone 'scary' will do!"

Wow... this sez it all...

JeffreyS

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Re: Zimmerman Found Not Guilty
« Reply #680 on: July 22, 2013, 10:19:16 AM »
Here's something that helps flavor the whole situation for me.  Walking through the office this morning one of the women who work here is laughing watching a video of a Black minister explaining to his congregation why Trayvon had it coming. Why the preacher thought it was ok to give a comical sermon blaming Trayvon and she thought it was ok to be laughing about a situation that left a 17 year old boy dead I think is disgusting.  I wonder how many Zimmerman supporters are proud to be on their team?

Shine

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Re: Zimmerman Found Not Guilty
« Reply #681 on: July 22, 2013, 10:39:51 AM »
Since I believe in the concept of Institutional Racism is alive and well in our country, the only real racial connection I see in this particular trial is the initial profiling of Martin, which set off the entire chain of events, IMO. GZ doesn't view TM as a suspicious person if he was not of a male of a certain skin color. No following happens and each guy goes on his merry way.

However, the real issue (which I think we both agree on) is the interpretation and understanding of laws surrounding this particular case.  For me, that's not about race. No one, regardless of their skin color, should be able to be legally killed under these types of circumstances.  If we need to better flesh out laws and our understanding on them, then let's do it.
« Last Edit: July 22, 2013, 10:43:28 AM by Shine »

thelakelander

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Re: Zimmerman Found Not Guilty
« Reply #682 on: July 22, 2013, 10:53:28 AM »
Also, there's a difference between racial profiling and being a racist.  I do believe that people can profile with a built in perspective on a situation that may be based upon historical racial stereotypes.  If I were Zimmerman, what looked suspicious to him that night may have not looked the same through my eyes. However, I don't believe that makes Zimmerman a racist.  Sheclown posted a great video of people's reactions to a white guy, black guy, and white girl attempting to steal a bike somewhere on this site, last week.  I think the reactions of people are a great example of the point I'm trying to make.

As for the kid thing, if Zimmerman had sex with Martin, he would have been thrown in jail.  Martin was a kid. All of us know we're a lot smarter now at our current ages than we were in high school and residing under the roof of an adult. There's nothing wrong pointing that out. Especially, when there's a push by many to paint him as an equal victim, sharing the responsibility of what happened that night with a grown man who pursued him.

Shine

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Re: Zimmerman Found Not Guilty
« Reply #683 on: July 22, 2013, 11:51:19 AM »
I personally think that people should be pissed off that their laws are being created by private right wing boards with the complicity of huge corporations and a few local collaborators.

Yes, they should be.   Apathy is an unfortunate choice.

sheclown

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Re: Zimmerman Found Not Guilty
« Reply #684 on: July 22, 2013, 12:03:57 PM »
Also, there's a difference between racial profiling and being a racist.  I do believe that people can profile with a built in perspective on a situation that may be based upon historical racial stereotypes.  If I were Zimmerman, what looked suspicious to him that night may have not looked the same through my eyes. However, I don't believe that makes Zimmerman a racist.  Sheclown posted a great video of people's reactions to a white guy, black guy, and white girl attempting to steal a bike somewhere on this site, last week.  I think the reactions of people are a great example of the point I'm trying to make.

As for the kid thing, if Zimmerman had sex with Martin, he would have been thrown in jail.  Martin was a kid. All of us know we're a lot smarter now at our current ages than we were in high school and residing under the roof of an adult. There's nothing wrong pointing that out. Especially, when there's a push by many to paint him as an equal victim, sharing the responsibility of what happened that night with a grown man who pursued him.

I will share a story from my personal experience.

I was walking down the sidewalk near Pasco's Hardware.  This was a couple of years ago.  I feel, for the most part, safe wherever I go.  I don't worry about it too much.

However, I was walking down the sidewalk when a group of three or four young black men were approaching me --

I felt myself tense up. 

As they passed me by, one of them said "hey, Miss Glory". 

I said to myself, "damn".

It is so ingrained into my consciousness that I reacted automatically.  Without thinking.

Does this action make me a racist?  I don't believe it does.

Does it prove that I can respond with institutional racism?  I believe it does.


Shine

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Re: Zimmerman Found Not Guilty
« Reply #685 on: July 22, 2013, 12:05:21 PM »

As for the kid thing . . . Martin was a kid. All of us know we're a lot smarter now at our current ages than we were in high school and residing under the roof of an adult. There's nothing wrong pointing that out. Especially, when there's a push by many to paint him as an equal victim, sharing the responsibility of what happened that night with a grown man who pursued him.

sheclown

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Re: Zimmerman Found Not Guilty
« Reply #686 on: July 22, 2013, 12:08:54 PM »

As for the kid thing . . . Martin was a kid. All of us know we're a lot smarter now at our current ages than we were in high school and residing under the roof of an adult. There's nothing wrong pointing that out. Especially, when there's a push by many to paint him as an equal victim, sharing the responsibility of what happened that night with a grown man who pursued him.

and yet has legal protections covering his inexperience

FSBA

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Re: Zimmerman Found Not Guilty
« Reply #687 on: July 22, 2013, 01:54:39 PM »
http://abcnews.go.com/US/george-zimmerman-emerged-hiding-truck-crash-rescue/story?id=19735432

George Zimmerman, who has been in hiding since he was acquitted of murder in the death of Trayvon Martin, emerged to help rescue a family who was trapped in an overturned vehicle, police said today.

Zimmerman was one of two men who came to the aid of a family of four -- two parents and two children -- trapped inside a blue Ford Explorer SUV that had rolled over after traveling off the highway in Sanford, Fla. at approximately 5:45 p.m. Thursday, the Seminole County Sheriff's Office said in a statement.

sheclown

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Re: Zimmerman Found Not Guilty
« Reply #688 on: July 22, 2013, 06:09:08 PM »
Thanks Sheclown, I appreciate your opinion.  My personal experience and opinion often seems so different from some here.  I find it interesting to try to see where people develop their beliefs.   Read this article and tell me what you think (I agree with its premis):

http://legalinsurrection.com/2013/07/radical-gun-control-zombies-exploit-grieving-black-community//#more



Stand your ground, IMHO, is a symptom of the problem, not the problem itself.  I really don't have strong feelings about gun control.  I have owned handguns in the past, when I went camping in remote places it gave me a sense of safety.  That being said, I'm not in favor of liberal gun laws either.

As far as SYG goes, I think it is asking for trouble since the survivor of the conflict is the one who tells the story.  Seems ripe for trouble.

And Stephen's ALEC info is rather mind-blowing.

The Grief and Anger in the Black Community is Real

duh

The Disinformation War Waged on the Black Community


I think that river flows in both directions.


If The Lies Are Believed, Anger and Outrage Are Understandable, Inevitable


how generous

So How Does All This Tie Into Stand-Your-Ground Protests?

I do think it is a safe target (and a worthy one at that).  It is easier for people to target their anger at SYG than deal with the institutional racism that we need to deal with.

Radical Gun Control Zombies Remain Mindlessly Persistent

It is admirable to be persistent when you are fighting for a cause.



And this should surprise anyone?
----------------------------------------------------------

What I do appreciate is your attention to that stalking matter NotNow.  And in spite of the fact that we often disagree, I usually, mostly always, appreciate hearing your perspective.

Finally,  this is much larger than a problem for the black community.  It is a problem for all -- the whole community.

« Last Edit: July 22, 2013, 07:33:11 PM by sheclown »

thelakelander

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Re: Zimmerman Found Not Guilty
« Reply #689 on: July 26, 2013, 09:46:40 AM »
The law legalized the killing.  I think by now, that's pretty clear.  To many people, the guy got away with murder, which is why there is a cry to have the laws reviewed and modified, if possible.