Khan's Jacksonville Shipyards Plans Revealed

[avonjax]

Sorry folks, I don't buy into any of this. Where was this guy? And Lakelander my only question is if there is more interest in the site than we think, where has everyone been? Like my comments on the other thread I know Khan is not spending a lot of his money on his plan but I think he can attract serious people to invest. And I will repeat my frustration; the shipyards closed 23 years ago and 15 years after the first "plan" nothing has happened except the loss of the River City Music Sheds.

[avonjax]

And......
Here we go again I suspect we will be discussing the new proposal for the shipyards in another 15 years. And another debate about who will pay, who will clean up and who has the best proposal for this project.
(Sorry I've become a complete cynic about what happens downtown, especially this particular site.)
When I retire I may go ahead and move to Southside where all the amenities are. I can visit downtown on occasion like most Jax people.
I really hope I'm wrong on this one.

[thelakelander]

Blame the COJ and the economy for few proposals from the private sector over the years. No vision, bad market and contamination will slow down interest. Nevertheless, there have been interested parties over the years. Killashee and IAW are two. None of it matters without an RFP and the city letting it or a part of it go. I hope more than Khan and this guy respond to the upcoming RFP. Hopefully the proposal that brings the most benefit to the tax payer wins. The two we know of are both full of holes at this point. The RFP should help sort out reality from fantasy. If the best response happens to be a party other than Khan's group, so be it.

[I-10east]

^^^Lake, what do you think about super luxury yacht proposal mentioning an 'international festival marketplace'? I know that the proposal hasn't been seen yet, but does that sound too much like the Landing or what? 

[Non-RedNeck Westsider]

The RFP should help sort out reality from fantasy. If the best response happens to be a party other than Khan's group, so be it.

The way I look at it is that Khan couldn't care less WHO develops the property as long as it fits into his plan of integrating the core with the Jaguars and giving thousands of tourists that visit from August to December more reason to come visit the city.

IMO, he did what he had to do to ensure the ball got rolling in the right direction.  Kind of a crappy analogy, but it's not a fight until someone throws a punch, which Khan did with his proposal.  Now that the interest is there, I'm positive he'll use his influence (read - $$$$) to guarantee that whatever happens fits into his plans, but as Lake and others have pointed out, now that the ball is rolling, we need to ensure that we get what's best for us.

When (and if) this goes down, I would still give Khan the majority of the credit for making it happen. 

[thelakelander]

^^^Lake, what do you think about super luxury yacht proposal mentioning an 'international festival marketplace'? I know that the proposal hasn't been seen yet, but does that sound too much like the Landing or what? 

When I read "market", I picture a public market with seafood, meat, floral, cheese, bakery vendors, etc. The closest thing we have to that is the Jacksonville Farmers Market on Beaver. The retail, dining and entertainment suited for the Landing is more in line with the type of retail in Khan's plan. Nevertheless, it's too early to get caught up on conceptual uses at this point. The major differences right now is that one has a football training complex and the other has a yacht repair facility. That, and one wants the land for free and the other is willing to pay for it. The RFP should get us further detail and expose any other interested parties.

[hiddentrack]

^^^Lake, what do you think about super luxury yacht proposal mentioning an 'international festival marketplace'? I know that the proposal hasn't been seen yet, but does that sound too much like the Landing or what? 

When I read "market", I picture a public market with seafood, meat, floral, cheese, bakery vendors, etc. The closest thing we have to that is the Jacksonville Farmers Market on Beaver. The retail, dining and entertainment suited for the Landing is more in line with the type of retail in Khan's plan. Nevertheless, it's too early to get caught up on conceptual uses at this point. The major differences right now is that one has a football training complex and the other has a yacht repair facility. That, and one wants the land for free and the other is willing to pay for it. The RFP should get us further detail and expose any other interested parties.

I'd like to see the kind of public market you mention happen at the Landing, with that type of retail/dining/entertainment moving along Bay Street and becoming integrated into the Shipyards.

Between the two proposals, the Jaguars practice facilities looked like they would take up much less space than the proposed yacht repair facilities. For people who are hoping the shipyards property will incorporate as much public spaces possible, it could turn out to be a significant piece in Khan's favor.

That being said, I did like the post here several years back showing possible redevelopment around the stadiums, utilizing all those parking lots that sit empty most of the year. It will be interesting to see, if this second proposal or any others are serious, if we end up with any discussion about dividing up the property, where Khan gets some property along the river, which then stretches north closer to the stadium, with another developer or developers getting the remaining waterfront property for their projects.

[Marle Brando]

If this guy is serious. If the city has cojones and MOJO still working in their favor. If Im CEO Wallace, I'm gifting Khan the Shipyards land up to Kids Campus. Then I'm selling of the MetroPark, Kids Campus to Mullen at the difference between the 15mil, and the amount it would take to clean Hogans Creek, site Remediation, and Bay st improvements. Then as a consolation, I'd gift Mullen the surface lots around the stadium for his market place idea, as well as the Jacksonville Fairgrounds Property. The Veterans Memorial wall/mural would be moved to Shipyards Next to the USS Adams Museum. The money from the city's raised percentage (35%) of Khans selling the shipyards land would be then diverted to the Landing and Laura Trio Project. I would then work with the owners of the WJCT station land and owners of the waterfront acreage from there to the Hart's Bridge for the private, non Riverwalk aspect of the Yatch Facilities. The Tailgate Lots in Talleyrand would then become my new Jacksonville Fairgrounds. The beauty of Public/Private Partnership, everybody wins. At most, the city will be on tab for its part of the mega-garages that will replace the current lots. As far as the aquarium is concern...Southbank school board building, MOSH land..I'm looking at you! Its all complicated but realistically achievable if all parties wanted to WIN, wanted a cohesive comprehensive plan in which an entire new district can realistically be developed.
The interest is there. The money is there. The ideas are there. Just get it done already Jacksonville, we can make it all happen simultaneously. Now enter naysayers and taxpayers

[downtownbrown]

^while you are at it, how about taking out the old courthouse parking lot and Coastal Drive and construct a world class Jacksonville Municipal Marina a la the Charleston City Marina.  im sure it would be a popular way point for all the north/south seasonal traffic.

[RattlerGator]

Before Marle Brando's post, most every one was writing without apparently giving any thought to the possibility -- possibility -- that this is also part of Shad's larger process. Who knows, maybe these two groups have even had formal or, at least, informal contact.

So much potential downtown, so much hope and faith in Shad. Lakelander talked of Shad's proposal (and this new one) being full of holes. Meat is going to be put on the bones, of that I'm certain. I'm also certain Shad has some aces in the hole and is simply waiting to show them once he is granted the development control he is seeking.

We'll soon see. One thing we do know; Shad has shaken (and is shaking) the tree. For that, I'm pleased.

[Jdog]

85 to 5000 employees in 5 years is not fantasy.  It's just a lie of ludicrous proportions.  Maybe this guy has hated money having gone to the Jags; or doesn't like Mr. Khan; or wants to see a better deal for the city with Mr. Khan.  Maybe he just took a shot because he's oh-so selfish and cynical, thinking the city would downplay the value of the property to make the deal with Khan's group more palatable for public consumption, thus opening an outside chance to put up cash, encapsulated with a fantastical employment promise, to get the property at a good price.  No need to pay for the riverwalk extension, no need to give a crap about future, silly, irrelevant tax breaks for growing this impossible employment "promise" as presented.  If he pulls it off it's because he sees morons, and the public gets to see the property linger as a passive investment wasteland for quite some more time.

[thelakelander]

If he does pull it off, the city could possibly end up +$75 million for DT development. Shipyards or another site, we can find ways to work with Khan. Availability of underutilized public land is not a problem in Jax. I can't wait to see the RFP results.

[Marle Brando]

^while you are at it, how about taking out the old courthouse parking lot and Coastal Drive and construct a world class Jacksonville Municipal Marina a la the Charleston City Marina.  im sure it would be a popular way point for all the north/south seasonal traffic.

Great idea!  I would make this a part of my new Jacksonville Landing district. A wharf/marina would be a great place maker..along with a converted city hall annex into AFFORDABLE apartments for students, singles, professionals, and maybe a farmers/fish market integrated into the wharf. I'd be so disappointed if the city is operating with a closed minded approach and not opening up to the endless opportunities this moment in time offers us. I'm so nervous that we may not have the right officials in place with vision and know how to make the most of this golden opprtunity.

[MusicMan]

After reviewing all three threads which currently address Khan's Shipyard proposal, the history of the site, and the most recent failed proposals to develop the property, it's nearly impossible to see why the site has not been cleaned up yet. That is 100% on the city and of course nothing can be done without environmental remediation. There have been major proposals spanning the Delaney and Peyton administrations and throughout all that the City never stepped up and took care of the site.  In the immediate vicinity you have the skeletal remains of Berkman II
and the hulking Dept of Corrections site, so you have to give Shad Khan some credit for evening stepping up and proposing something this grand.  God help him.

[JBTripper]

I won't address the validity of this kind of venture (the Mooneyhan factor let's call it) but I will say this would have tremendous benefits to the city if it became a reality. Having a few dozen Khans floating around downtown Jacksonville? Heck, it could make some of Khan's plans somewhat feasible.

The Mullen guy supposedly has a home in Jax. Says woukd move HQ to Jax. Has 85 employees now. Expect 250 in 18 months and 5k in 5 years.  Hmmm. Seems even more pie in sky than Khans pretty pictures.

With $1.4 billion to spend it's actually believable...if that money is actually there.

And how does it make sense to move your mega-yacht shop to Jacksonville, where there is exactly one owner of one "mega-yacht" who stays here part time, from South Florida, where there are many more mega-yachts in-and-out of there year-round?

He says this is the closest to South Florida where he can get insurance for this type of operation during hurricane season. I guess our geographic location pays dividends once again.

He says that, but I'm not sure that's how insurance works. Scientifically speaking, Jacksonville is every bit as susceptible to hurricanes as Miami and any other coastal city from New Orleans around the horn and up to New Jersey. We've just been extraordinarily lucky for a long, long time. If anything, that part of the story makes it all the more unbelievable to me.

That, and Shitake 1.) Apparently does not even have a company website and 2.) is not even spelled correctly.