Zimmerman Found Not Guilty

[JeffreyS]

It seems the evidence is there for manslaughter and certainly the kid's civil rights were violated.  As I've continued to state, I don't think this is over by a long shot.  Nevertheless, we can't raise TM from the dead but we can work to save other innocent people from similar fates.

What civil right was violated?

I think your right there isn't an implicit right.  That is why I think we need to enact a law that expresses the right to flee danger without continuing harassment.  Certainly if we are allowed to use deadly force for just believing we are in danger we ought to be able to flee if we believe we are in danger.

IMO Zimmerman's continued pursuit, after he noted in the 911 call that TM was running, should constituent harassment (not stating that as law). If we make it law then his weapon would have been used in the act of a crime and not justifiable by self defense.

Lots of folks trying to oversimplify this case by stating: "A 17 year old is dead, and that's all that needs to be said."  Unfortunately, its not that simple.  Zimmerman had to be found guilty beyond a reasonable doubt and the jury could not get to that level of certainty. 

Agree, I think the jury made the right call according to the law. I think the law should be changed so the when the skittles toting teenager runs from the gun toting block captain it frees the teen from having to further deal with whoever it is he feels he needs to flee.

Seems to me running issues a pretty strong statement that I would feel safer with some distance from who I am running from. That statement seems like a reasonable request.  Do you not think bird dogging someone who flees from you is a kind of harassment?

[Gators312]

go here to sign a petition.

http://www.naacp.org/page/s/doj-civil-rights-petition

If her son is not safe...



no mother's son is safe. 

bottom line.

When was her son safe?  No one's children are safe today, they weren't safe in the days, weeks, years before Trayvon died.  Murderers, kidnappers and rapists have been stealing our children yet few people have shown the outrage they are showing over this case.

This was a terrible tragedy, and there are terrible tragedies every day just ask Robert Sutton. 

Until we take on the issues that Lake has mentioned in this thread, there are many more dangers for our children than a fluke like the GZ incident.

[NotNow]

Murder and manslaughter are State charges.  I am not aware of any ability by the federal government to charge citizens with violation of any "civil right to live".   The Police Officers in the Rodney King case were charged with civil rights violations because they were acting under color of law, or under their authority as Police.  I will defer to an attorney who is familiar with this area of law, but I don't see it.

In any event, this would appear to be a violation of double jeapordy.   There may yet be some legal action at the state level, and the parents of Martin will file a civil lawsuit.

I agree that manslaughter was the appropriate charge, but it was an included charge in the trial and apparently, at least in the eyes of the jury, it was not proved in trial.  Zimmerman has been tried and aquitted.  It is certainly not a perfect system, but it is the best we have. 

It is my understanding, correct me if I am wrong, that Zimmerman testified that he lost sight of Martin, and then upon exitin his truck he was pysically attacked by Martin without warning.  I don't know if there were witnesses to that beyond Mr. Zimmerman.  I did hear a witness testifying that he saw what appeared to be Mr. Martin on top of Mr. Zimmerman striking him.  This was apparently enough for the jury not to assign guilt to Mr. Zimmerman.  So it appears to me that it was not the Zimmermans testimony of  "fleeing" that caused the jury to come back with their verdict, but his testimony of a sudden physical attack without warning. 

This is a judgement call in my opinion.  A tough one for the jury.  Mr. Martin is dead and could not present his own testament as to what happened.  All the jury had was the evidence that was presented. 

I don't see what laws should be changed.  We live in an imperfect world.  Of course no one's son is safe.  No one is completely safe.  Giving up liberties to chase "security" is a false hope.  Your actions have consequences.  Both Zimmerman and Martin's actions that night had consequences.  A different choice at any stage leads to different results.  This tragic case has been hijacked by others to be used for their own purposes.  I see the language being repeated here... "wanna be cop", "wanna be thug", "twice his size", etc.  and even worse.  I don't believe there is a lot more to this other than a civil trial, which will award any monetary profit from this circus to the Martin family.   

[fsquid]

Govt going after Zimmerman sets a dangerous precedent that will assuredly do more harm than good.

[acme54321]

Govt going after Zimmerman sets a dangerous precedent that will assuredly do more harm than good.

Agreed

[NotNow]

As I have previously stated, I would have thought that a manslaughter conviction was appropriate in this case.   The jury did not agree. 

What other "security guy shooting a teenager to death" cases are you speaking of?

[JeffreyS]

I do not see adding a law that explicitly states one right to flee without harassment as giving up liberty.  I do not think it was relevant in this case under current law but Zimmerman said he's running in the 911 call.  He should have been allowed to avoid Zimmerman by Fleeing IMO.

I think an educational effort after a "You are protected if you run law" would teach people to watch their homes and neighborhoods without harassing people who do something like ("he look's like he's on drugs just walking while it's raining"GZ).

Fight or Flight instinct is real and when you take away the flight option you shouldn't get cover when the fight instinct takes over.

[JeffreyS]

Govt going after Zimmerman sets a dangerous precedent that will assuredly do more harm than good.

BS if this wasn't a politically charged case just a simple child murder we would all want the government to pursue every legal means to take the child killer off the street.

[fsquid]

It seems the evidence is there for manslaughter and certainly the kid's civil rights were violated.  As I've continued to state, I don't think this is over by a long shot.  Nevertheless, we can't raise TM from the dead but we can work to save other innocent people from similar fates.

What civil right was violated?

I'm no attorney but many are saying his right to live is one. I guess we'll see in upcoming months.

so anyone found not guilty of murder can then be charged on a civil rights law?

[sheclown]

Whatever is wrong, needs to be fixed.  And needs to be fixed quickly.  We cannot live in a world where this is allowed to happen. 

The message sent is more than alarming

What was the message? 

Well.  Open season on young black men for one   Easy targets. No protection 

[NotNow]

I do not see adding a law that explicitly states one right to flee without harassment as giving up liberty.  I do not think it was relevant in this case under current law but Zimmerman said he's running in the 911 call.  He should have been allowed to avoid Zimmerman by Fleeing IMO.

I think an educational effort after a "You are protected if you run law" would teach people to watch their homes and neighborhoods without harassing people who do something like ("he look's like he's on drugs just walking while it's raining"GZ).

Fight or Flight instinct is real and when you take away the flight option you shouldn't get cover when the fight instinct takes over.

It is my understanding that the testimony claimed that Martin attacked Zimmerman without warning after Zimmerman got out of his truck.  With no evidence to contradict that testimony, then any "fleeing" law would not apply.  Current law would protect any citizen who is attempting to flee danger.  Had there been any evidence that Zimmerman "caught up to" Martin and attacked him then I am sure there would have been a conviction.

[If_I_Loved_you]

AngryMuffin when they call you Troll it's because you have gotten under their skin?

1.  no.  it has an actual meaning.

2.  while its true there isnt a great appetite for 'stupid' around here, it doesnt mean you are trolling.

Stephen why don't you spell check what you post?

I often forget, especially when I am actually watching television.  In reality I don't ever use spell check.  Its usually lazy typing or autocorrect.  Predictably I was a spelling bee champion throughout my youth, and Im pretty accurate in a few languages.  But sometimes I type faster than I read.

sorry.

I just ran spell check and it says that I didn't add a contraction mark in the word "isn't".

I hope that it didn't completely distort my meaning.

It didn't it just looks better. Thank You

[fsquid]

Govt going after Zimmerman sets a dangerous precedent that will assuredly do more harm than good.

BS if this wasn't a politically charged case just a simple child murder we would all want the government to pursue every legal means to take the child killer off the street.

he was tried and found not guilty, that is the system.  Do you want the Feds getting involved in every case where people don't agree with the verdict?

[duvalbill]

Whatever is wrong, needs to be fixed.  And needs to be fixed quickly.  We cannot live in a world where this is allowed to happen. 

The message sent is more than alarming

What was the message? 

Well.  Open season on young black men for one   Easy targets. No protection 

I must assume you didn't watch a single second of the trial.  Otherwise, you wouldn't post such a silly response. 

[fsquid]

Whatever is wrong, needs to be fixed.  And needs to be fixed quickly.  We cannot live in a world where this is allowed to happen. 

The message sent is more than alarming

What was the message? 

Well.  Open season on young black men for one   Easy targets. No protection 

hyperbole