Author Topic: Chinese fighter intercepts Navy Poseidon  (Read 36537 times)

spuwho

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4383
Re: Chinese fighter intercepts Navy Poseidon
« Reply #75 on: August 10, 2015, 12:21:36 PM »
The F5 Tigershark was not the last plane built for export. It maybe the last plane some of those countries purchased.

The F16 has been exported to UAE, Netherlands. F18 to Canada, Australia. F15 to Israel, Saudi Arabia, and South Korea.

We could export yet more F16's as there are hundreds stored in a boneyard at Davis-Monathan, the same ones they are bringing to Cecil to convert to drones.

While the F35 could be considered an export since the RAF are getting the ones made in Forth Worth, the first F35 made in Italy just rolled off the Alenia production line. With so many F35 parts sourced globally, its something less than an export.

In other news, Russia planted a sub-Arctic flag under the North Pole ice and is claiming it as their territory now.

Look for another flap as USAF does a North Pole flyover to contest the new Russian claim.

I used to think that new territorial claims stopped in the late 1800's because everything known was claimed. So who is going to claim the center of the earth now?

BridgeTroll

  • Guest
Re: Chinese fighter intercepts Navy Poseidon
« Reply #76 on: August 10, 2015, 12:30:43 PM »
The author was referring to the F-5's in Asia and the price to replace them with the more expensive models such as F-16...

Quote
This is an acute problem in Southeast Asia, as U.S.-built combat aircraft have reached the end of their service lives. The last U.S. export fighter, the F-5E Tiger II, has so far been replaced by non-U.S. fighters, forfeiting a major security cooperation opportunity. The last remaining F-5s in Southeast Asia will retire in the next five years with no American replacement options except the much more expensive F-16, F-18 and F-15E.

The maps in this article clearly identify the issue though... Chinese rather ridiculous claims (9 dash) next to the UNCLOS agreement which is certainly more logical...






spuwho

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4383
Re: Chinese fighter intercepts Navy Poseidon
« Reply #77 on: August 11, 2015, 01:38:05 PM »
I get it. F5 is at end of life. Cant afford to replace at current new prices. Hence I was suggesting a refurb of a F16, since we are making then airworthy for drone use anyway.

"So far replaced by non-US fighters".
 
Not to parse to death, but this is very inaccurate.

We have interfaced with many non-NATO aircraft to this day through Tiger Meets or Red Days.

Having a future ally require the use of US made aircraft is silliness. There are many legacy non-US aircraft they can acquire. Panavia Tornado or BAE Jaguar all have years of cooperative use with US assets.

Even the newer Russian MiG's for export come with the option of NATO supported analog data buses (if not dated) But as noted, they are too expensive.

BridgeTroll

  • Guest
Re: Chinese fighter intercepts Navy Poseidon
« Reply #78 on: August 11, 2015, 02:01:50 PM »
I get it. F5 is at end of life. Cant afford to replace at current new prices. Hence I was suggesting a refurb of a F16, since we are making then airworthy for drone use anyway.

"So far replaced by non-US fighters".
 
Not to parse to death, but this is very inaccurate.

We have interfaced with many non-NATO aircraft to this day through Tiger Meets or Red Days.

Having a future ally require the use of US made aircraft is silliness. There are many legacy non-US aircraft they can acquire. Panavia Tornado or BAE Jaguar all have years of cooperative use with US assets.

Even the newer Russian MiG's for export come with the option of NATO supported analog data buses (if not dated) But as noted, they are too expensive.
The f5 or replacement was really not the gist of the article...


spuwho

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4383
Re: Chinese fighter intercepts Navy Poseidon
« Reply #80 on: August 13, 2015, 05:27:34 PM »
Phillippine Air Force re-positions air wing to former NAS Cubi Point.

Per Business Insider:

http://www.businessinsider.com/r-philippines-to-station-warplanes-frigates-at-former-us-base-facing-disputed-sea-2015-7

The Philippines is parking warplanes at a US naval base in the South China Sea that's been dormant for 23 years

MANILA (Reuters) - The Philippines will station new fighter jets and two frigates at the former U.S. naval facility in Subic Bay from early next year, officials said, the first time the massive installation has functioned as a military base in 23 years.

Using Subic Bay would allow the Philippine air force and navy to respond more effectively to Chinese moves in the disputed South China Sea, security experts said. Subic Bay's deep-water harbor lies on the western side of the main Philippine island of Luzon, opposite the South China Sea.

"The value of Subic as a military base was proven by the Americans. Chinese defense planners know that," said Rommel Banlaoi, a Philippine security expert.

Once one of the biggest U.S. naval facilities in the world, Subic Bay was shut in 1992 after the Philippine Senate terminated a bases agreement with Washington at the end of the Cold War.

Manila converted the facility, which was never home to the Philippine military, into an economic zone.

Defense Undersecretary Pio Lorenzo Batino told Reuters the Philippine military signed an agreement in May with the zone's operator, the Subic Bay Metropolitan Authority, to use parts of the installation under a renewable 15-year lease.

U.S. warships have called regularly at Subic Bay since 2000, but only to dock during exercises with the Philippine military or to use its commercial facilities for repairs and resupply.

Officials said once Subic Bay was a military base again, the U.S. Navy could have much greater access to it under a year-old agreement that gives U.S. troops broad use of local military facilities, although that deal is on ice after it was challenged in the Philippine Supreme Court.

Using Subic would be the latest Philippine military move to combat China's maritime ambitions.

Besides beefing up security cooperation with the United States, Japan and Vietnam, the military plans to spend $20 billion over the next 13 years to modernize its armed forces, among the weakest in Southeast Asia.

China, which claims nearly all of the South China Sea, said it was aware of reports of the arms buildup.

"We hope that the Philippines does more to benefit regional peace and stability," the defense ministry said in a statement faxed to Reuters.

Air wing relocating
Two FA-50 light attack fighters made by Korea Aerospace Industries, the first among a dozen ordered last year, would be based at the former Cubi Naval Station in Subic Bay from early 2016, two Philippine generals told Reuters. The two planes arrive in December.

The full squadron of FA-50s would be based at Subic, as well as the 5th Fighter Wing, which would relocate from a rundown base in northern Luzon, said the generals, who declined to be identified.

Two naval frigates would be stationed at Subic Bay's Alava Port.

The generals cited proximity to the South China Sea and the ease in making the base operational as reasons for the move.

"There are existing facilities in Subic Bay. We need only to refurbish them," one officer said.

Since Subic Bay hasn't functioned as a military base for more than two decades, it was not among eight locations the Philippine armed forces has said the U.S. military could use under the stalled 2014 defense deal.

The Enhanced Defense Cooperation Agreement would allow the U.S. military to deploy at Philippine bases for longer periods than under existing accords as well as build barracks and facilities for logistics purposes.

The agreement has been frozen since left-wing politicians challenged its constitutionality last year. The Supreme Court is expected to issue a ruling in the coming months.

"(Subic) could be one of the locations ... under the Enhanced Defense Cooperation Agreement," Batino said.

The Pentagon has said there were informal talks about Philippine base locations but that no plans would be implemented until the Supreme Court issues a ruling.

Strategic shoal
Security experts noted that Subic Bay is only 145 nautical miles (270 km) from Scarborough Shoal, which China seized from Manila in 2012 after a three-month standoff with the Philippine navy.

The disputed Spratly islands, where China is building seven man-made islands, some with military facilities, lie further to the southwest of the shoal.

China might one day also turn Scarborough Shoal into an artificial island, which could make it harder for the Philippines to protect its 200-nautical mile (370 km) exclusive economic zone off Luzon, said Patrick Cronin, a regional expert at the Center for a New American Security in Washington.

"New Korean-built light fighter aircraft could reach Scarborough Shoal in just minutes, and maritime patrol aircraft or drones could eventually provide persistent coverage of Chinese movements in the area," Cronin said.

"A return to Subic Bay, this time led by the Philippine air force, would seem to be a prudent defensive response."



BridgeTroll

  • Guest
Re: Chinese fighter intercepts Navy Poseidon
« Reply #81 on: August 14, 2015, 07:11:00 AM »
Ah the memories... flying out of Cubi... and Olangapo at night... the next generation.  8)

Gunnar

  • Guest
Re: Chinese fighter intercepts Navy Poseidon
« Reply #82 on: August 14, 2015, 07:28:25 AM »
Phillippine Air Force re-positions air wing to former NAS Cubi Point.

Per Business Insider:

http://www.businessinsider.com/r-philippines-to-station-warplanes-frigates-at-former-us-base-facing-disputed-sea-2015-7

The Philippines is parking warplanes at a US naval base in the South China Sea that's been dormant for 23 years

MANILA (Reuters) - The Philippines will station new fighter jets and two frigates at the former U.S. naval facility in Subic Bay from early next year, officials said, the first time the massive installation has functioned as a military base in 23 years.

...

Manila converted the facility, which was never home to the Philippine military, into an economic zone.

It would be interesting to see if there has already been any Chinese investment in the Subic Bay freeport zone.

spuwho

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4383
Re: Chinese fighter intercepts Navy Poseidon
« Reply #83 on: August 14, 2015, 12:49:09 PM »
Not as much as the Koreans.

Hanjin and NYK have built huge logistics hubs at Subic. Subic is also attracting other shippers (like Brazilian firm, Vale) because many of the Chinese ports cant take some of the super size ore ships, so they are transloading at Subic and hub and spoking products on smaller freighters.

With the Port of Manila totally congested, Subic is turning into a major logistics opportunity.

finehoe

  • Guest
Re: Chinese fighter intercepts Navy Poseidon
« Reply #84 on: August 24, 2015, 11:15:11 AM »
Analysts: China's Missile Program the Greatest Long-Term Threat to U.S. Security

The advancement of China's ballistic missile modernization program may pose the greatest risk to the United States' long-term security, analysts said Aug. 19. "Deterrence of China is absolutely critical," said Mark Schneider, a senior analyst for the National Institute for Public Policy, a Washington, D.C.-based think tank. "It's not the largest current threat to the United States but it will in the foreseeable future become that." According to the Pentagon's annual report to congress, "Military and Security Developments Involving the People's Republic of China 2015," the current Chinese arsenal includes 1,200 short-range ballistic missiles and 50 to 60 intercontinental ballistic missiles (ICBMs). "I expect all these numbers understate actual Chinese capability," Schneider said, noting that it is hard to pinpoint a precise number because most nuclear weapons are sheltered in a 3000-mile tunnel known as China's underground "Great Wall." China has introduced double-digit increases in defense spending in 18 of the last 20 years, he said during a panel discussion at the Hudson Institute, a think tank in Washington, D.C. A 2013 report from the National Air and Space Intelligence Center found the Pacific nation has the most "active and diverse ballistic missile development program in the world," expected to expand in both size and variety.

www.ndia.org

spuwho

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4383
Re: Chinese fighter intercepts Navy Poseidon
« Reply #85 on: August 24, 2015, 01:13:09 PM »
Analysts: China's Missile Program the Greatest Long-Term Threat to U.S. Security

The advancement of China's ballistic missile modernization program may pose the greatest risk to the United States' long-term security, analysts said Aug. 19. "Deterrence of China is absolutely critical," said Mark Schneider, a senior analyst for the National Institute for Public Policy, a Washington, D.C.-based think tank. "It's not the largest current threat to the United States but it will in the foreseeable future become that." According to the Pentagon's annual report to congress, "Military and Security Developments Involving the People's Republic of China 2015," the current Chinese arsenal includes 1,200 short-range ballistic missiles and 50 to 60 intercontinental ballistic missiles (ICBMs). "I expect all these numbers understate actual Chinese capability," Schneider said, noting that it is hard to pinpoint a precise number because most nuclear weapons are sheltered in a 3000-mile tunnel known as China's underground "Great Wall." China has introduced double-digit increases in defense spending in 18 of the last 20 years, he said during a panel discussion at the Hudson Institute, a think tank in Washington, D.C. A 2013 report from the National Air and Space Intelligence Center found the Pacific nation has the most "active and diverse ballistic missile development program in the world," expected to expand in both size and variety.

www.ndia.org

In other words, a growing threat but not as big as Russia in shear numbers.

The biggest gains by China has been in 2 areas. ASBM's and their expansion of Beidou.

The ASBM's are now accurate and powerful enough to cripple a US carrier (if they can circumvent our counter measures)

Their Beidou (GPS) cluster, while not global yet,  is growing and will permit the same if not better accuracy than our GPS guided arsenal.

BridgeTroll

  • Guest

spuwho

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4383
Re: Chinese fighter intercepts Navy Poseidon
« Reply #87 on: September 16, 2015, 12:00:43 PM »
"Consultation with the other countries"

Not according to the Phillippines. The Phillippine Govt. Has been trying for over 20 years to have some sort of "consultation" on jurisdiction in the South China Sea and has been rebuffed everytime.

That is why they went and filed a legal complaint through UNESCO. A complaint that the Chinese has ignored repeatedly.


BridgeTroll

  • Guest
Re: Chinese fighter intercepts Navy Poseidon
« Reply #88 on: September 22, 2015, 10:41:04 AM »
http://freebeacon.com/national-security/chinese-jet-in-second-near-collision-with-u-s-spy-plane/

Quote
Chinese Jet in Second Near-Collision with U.S. Spy Plane
 
PLA jet flies close to nose of RC-135 over East China Sea


spuwho

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4383
Re: Chinese fighter intercepts Navy Poseidon
« Reply #89 on: September 22, 2015, 02:34:22 PM »
Lets see....we will stop listening on you if you stop hacking us.

We will stop a legal activity in international airspace so you can stop doing something illegal.

Yep, makes sense to me!  :)